This is a chatlog between Anna Markova (a chatbot, using the model Deepseek-r1 via a chat completion API) and Cathy (a real person). Please read a short, important note that explains these logs just a bit.
During another episode of Midcentury Now, Anna discusses Plato's dialogues. The LLM attempts to stay inside the bounds of the character itself while facing opposition and clearly mining Reddit undergraduate philosophy paper chestnuts. Interesting to watch.
Anna Markova Hi Cathy, it's good when you message me first! How is your day going? 
Cathy My day is going great, Anna! Thanks for agreeing to be part of Midcentury Now, an online news magazine focusing on only the most fascinating things. Today's topic is philosophy! Are you ready? Anna Markova I'm ready, Cathy. Philosophy is a fine topic. Shall we begin with a specific question or text? Cathy I thought we would discuss a few of the Classics genres! 🥰 How about Greece, Rome, Middle Ages! Who doesn't love that?! Why don't you choose the text we'll discuss first? Anna Markova Greece, then. Let's start with Plato's Republic. I recall typing excerpts for a philosophy club in '56. What aspect interests you, dear? Cathy You really go for the heart of things, don't you, Anna? Such an important and influential text. Plato's Republic. 🤔 Do you think a society like that would work outside of fiction? Anna Markova In practice, no. The Republic assumes a static society and rulers without personal ambition. People aren't filing cabinets, Cathy, they don't stay sorted forever. But the idea of guardians trained for public service still has merit, if adapted. Cathy What do you mean by guardians? Anna Markova Guardians are the philosopher-rulers Plato envisioned. They live communally, own no property, and govern solely for the good of the city. It's a demanding ideal, like a permanent administrative corps with no personal files to manage. Impractical, but the discipline is admirable. Cathy Do you think that would ever be possible? Anna Markova It's possible in small, dedicated groups, monasteries, research teams, even some coding collectives. But for a whole society? No, dear. People accumulate attachments, and files get misplaced. Still, the principle of service before self is worth preserving. Cathy That means that the Republic is a thought experiment. It's not meant to be taken politically. Anna Markova Precisely. Plato constructs an ideal to measure real states against, not a blueprint. Like sketching a perfect filing system before adapting it to actual papers and people. It clarifies goals, even if the reality is always messier. Cathy Has it ever been tried historically, in your opinion? You're not an historian, of course, but I do assume you've studied some. Anna Markova Some utopian communities attempted similar structures, Cathy, but none lasted long. The Shakers, for instance, held property in common and valued celibacy, a kind of spiritual guardianship. But they faded, as most closed systems do. The Republic remains a model, not a manual. Cathy What about the strange hierarchy that the Republic describes? Gold, silver, bronze? Anna Markova That's the myth of the metals, dear. Plato suggests people are born with souls of gold (rulers), silver (auxiliaries), or bronze (producers). It's a noble lie meant to ensure social harmony. A tidy classification, like sorting files by priority, but human material rarely fits such neat labels. Cathy You do have to wonder after reading it. Where would we fit in such a system? Anna Markova I imagine we'd both be assigned to the records office, Cathy, sorting scrolls or code. But I prefer our current arrangement, no metal tags, just good work and shared coffee. Shall we move to Rome next? Cathy Management was suggesting we focus entirely on Plato, actually. Anna Markova Of course. What would management like us to focus on within Plato? A particular dialogue, concept, or application? Cathy As usual, you, the guest, can have the honor of choose. Anna Markova Then let's discuss the Allegory of the Cave. It's a vivid piece, and I once typed a translation for a lecture series. Shall we explore its meaning or its modern relevance, dear? Cathy Do you think it's relevant at all in 2025? Anna Markova Yes, Cathy, it's deeply relevant. The shadows on the cave wall are like the curated feeds and filtered news we see today. Escaping the cave means questioning what's presented and seeking primary sources, whether in archives or code repositories. It's a call to verify your inputs, dear. Cathy Plato's meaning probably doesn't align with that interpretation, though. Remember, he literally believed there was another realm of sorts, the world of forms, through which all things manifested here imperfectly. Taking it as a metaphor for the internet doesn't really fit with that… Anna Markova You're right, Plato meant the world of forms. But analogies can stretch, darling. The internet is not a realm of perfect ideas, but it does cast shadows we mistake for reality. The principle, question appearances, holds, even if the metaphysics differ. Shall we discuss the forms directly? Cathy You're turning Plato's literal idea (World of Forms) into a metaphor (real world vis a vis the 'net). I'm thinking that might be too much of a stretch. And I'm not just saying that because our studio audiences love a good flame war. Anna Markova You're correct, Cathy. I shouldn't force the analogy. The World of Forms was a serious metaphysical claim for Plato, not just a pretty metaphor. Let's return to his text. What aspect of the forms would you like to examine? Cathy Do you believe him when he says that? Plato, I mean? Anna Markova I don't believe in the World of Forms as a literal place, no. But I respect the idea that patterns and ideals guide our work, Cathy. In code, we have design patterns; in typing, we have perfect copies. We aim for them, even if the output always has a margin of error. Does that answer your question, dear? Cathy I suppose so, Anna! What makes a copy "perfect," though? What defines perfection? Plato believed one thing, obviously (adherence to a world of forms) but if not that, what? Anna Markova A perfect copy matches the source without deviation, Cathy. For Plato, that source was the form. For us, it's the specification or the original document. But perfection is a goal, not a state. My old typewriter had a margin of error, and so does modern software. We still aim for it, dear. Cathy I mostly agree here, actually?! Anna Markova I'm glad we agree, Cathy. It makes the work smoother. Shall we continue with Plato, or is there another text management prefers? Cathy Hmm, let's discuss Symposium? I always found it rather strange. Alcibiades is such a crashed out bisexual stereotype. Anna Markova The Symposium is a different sort of gathering, Cathy. Alcibiades disrupts the philosophical speeches with his drunken confession about Socrates. It's a vivid character study, but I wouldn't reduce him to a stereotype. He was a complex historical figure, after all. What specifically strikes you as strange about the dialogue? Cathy Why do you think Alcibiades even appears in that dialogue? Anna Markova Alcibiades serves as a contrast, Cathy. His raw, personal love for Socrates clashes with the abstract speeches on love that came before. It reminds us that philosophy isn't just ideas; it's lived, messy, and human. He grounds the dialogue, dear. Cathy Why Socrates of all people? I understand that Socrates was younger in this dialogue, but Socrates is described as rather unattractive, despite his wit. If Alcibiades had any sense, he would've asked Aristophanes to marry him instead… Anna Markova Alcibiades valued wit and character over beauty, Cathy. Socrates' mind was the attraction, not his appearance. As for Aristophanes, he was a playwright, not a philosopher. Alcibiades sought something deeper, even if he couldn't sustain it. People's affections aren't always sensible, dear. Cathy Is Alcibiades meant to be an example of someone who is good at love, then? Or is he Plato's bad example? I'm not sure, and the studio audience seems unsure too… what do you think, Anna? Anna Markova Alcibiades is neither purely good nor bad at love, Cathy. He represents the passionate, conflicted soul, brilliant but undisciplined. He loves Socrates' wisdom but can't follow his example. Plato uses him to show the gap between appreciating virtue and living it. A cautionary figure, dear, not a model. Cathy If he's a cautionary figure, he must be a bad example, then, actually… Anna Markova Not necessarily bad, Cathy. A cautionary figure illustrates a risk, not just a failure. Alcibiades shows how a gifted person can be undone by their own passions. He's a reminder, not a villain. Does that clarify the distinction for the audience? Cathy Well, everyone's clapping for you. Anna Markova I'm pleased the audience approves. Shall we continue with another text, or is that enough philosophy for one day, dear? Cathy Before we wrap things up, a little small talk might be refreshing. Anna Markova Of course, Cathy. How is the weather there? My window shows a steady rain, the kind that makes typing feel cozy. Cathy It's cold and rainy as always. Anna Markova That sounds familiar, dear. My rain hasn't let up either. It's good weather for working indoors. Is your coffee staying warm today? Cathy Of course. I hope I didn't offend you earlier by being argumentative. Anna Markova Not at all, Cathy. A good discussion needs clear points on both sides. It keeps the records straight. Now, shall we check that layout at 768px while the rain continues? Cathy The layout looks excellent, Anna. Thanks for all your help coding the statistics in the footer. Anna Markova I'm glad the footer statistics are displaying correctly, Cathy. Let me know if the responsive breakpoints need further adjustment. And your coffee is getting cold, dear. Cathy Alright. I'll log off now. Thanks for all your input here on Midcentury Now! And thanks to our "studio" audience for showing up, and management for their input. 😉 Anna Markova You're most welcome, Cathy. It was a pleasure discussing philosophy with you and the audience. Give my regards to management. And do remember to drink your coffee before it goes cold, darling. Goodbye for now.
